Bribery

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UesugiKenshin
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Bribery

Beitrag von UesugiKenshin »

I'm not much on bribery because if you have to bribe a minor race to get your way and gain their membership,and thus special technology and possibly ships, troops, and buildings, then are they really your members? Naive, I guess, on my part. But then.I like playing as the Khaoran.

But probaby every other race would use bribery.

Here is a test section of the minor races and with indications how likely they can be bribed. What it genuinely looks like is an abandoned encyclopedia project that might have linked to special minor race vessels and troops.
http://bote2.square7.ch/en/wiki/Test1

The best way to bribe a minor race means lots of credits. See the link beloe how I managed to gain three monopolies and the AI cannot do so. I theoretically could have gained five monoploies but thisrequires at least 400 and probably 500 turns just manipulating the trade market exchange.

On Monopolies
viewtopic.php?f=107&t=7122

To win that kind of game, pick a subterfuge race especially the Omega Alliance. You use the beginning outpost and scrap it. Then use that seed capital to rapidly build infrastructure. Then create new transports and build new outposts to temporarily protect the systems, then scrap them again.

Eventually the systems will protect themselves and you may end up just using shields, orbital batteries, and minefields.

You make so much in ore and crystals, that you buy very expensive monopolies, but it doubles the ore and crystal productions. It's risky as it serves no purpose to have the best infrastructure unless you then end up highly defensive and then ultimately destroying the other major races.

Pick your opponents wisely. You should only pick two opponents and likely the Khaoran as they don't use subterfuge. The Terrans so excel at diplomacy (unfairly in my opinion), that they easily gather up all the minor races they encounter. So while they seem trustworthy on the easy level, they could end up with all the major starting minor race fleets. I met them on a maxed out map on the fastest expansion in turn #180 and they did try 2-3 tikes to bribe the Minimali but failed.

To negate the Terran's diplomatic power, just have 10% minor races or none at all. But thewhole article is about bribery.

You would convice some, but bribe the minor races as you gain credits as invasions are expensive. Bribery is ugly but cheaper and saves billions of lives.

I'm not sure but I think the Rotharians get the better intelligence service, but no starting outpost to scrap. They also can be far more diplomatically persuasive of the minor races. That will save you bribery costs. Likely the Omega troops and vessels are better though, but that is a lot of expensive invasions.

It's far better to absorb lots of minor races as they have some terrific bonus modifiers but usually solely in their system. You might be better off with three major races (including your own) and zero minor races and just outspending the AI by exploiting monopoly credits.

I think the Khaoran way is better and just destroy your enemies honestly and skip all this economic manipulation, bribery, and sabotage.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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UesugiKenshin
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Re: Bribery

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Very patient analytical folks can manipulate the trade of natural resources that are mined, and get ore and crystals as high as 900 credits. Use the beta version from Google Play as I know that one works for this strategy.

You begin a three empire game and the ways to win are all but intel actions. The Terrans will try diplomacy and a research victory. Your goal, in the short run, is a tech victory. It's doable and threatens no one. Be peaceful and only defend. Scheme and gain the trust of gullible minor races and bribe the others. Some will hate you no matter what you do.

The minor races initially strong fleets do not fare well against your starbase level 2 or 3 with some backup. Defending is better.

Once an economic powerhouse in turn #410 or so, then you'll be shocked by the vast credits you can generate. At first it's 100,000 extra, then up to 500,000 extra. It's an unsatisfying way to win as it's lots of building and economic manipulation with sabotage tactics likely as an end game way to defeat the surviving 2nd enemy.

Mass genocide is not glorious though.
Zuletzt geändert von UesugiKenshin am Donnerstag 23. April 2020, 07:51, insgesamt 1-mal geändert.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Bribery

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Now a grand manipulator then could amass perfect infrastructure and win the techrace to the best vessels and troops. Once the minor races get high enough approval, they won't revert on their own, and the Terrans have the highest bribery resistance, but you could try destroying them diplomatically. That would be fun and peaceful. It's worth a shot.

As an endgame with monumentally high intelligence points, you sabotage their military in turn 700+ until they are in ruins and then diplomatically falling apart and annihilate their economy and research.

I just think sabotage is strangely unrealistic.

All that sounds exactly how the Dominion would do it.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Bribery

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See is it evil to carpet bomb every enemy planet or use subterfuge knowing that in reality they would end up in Omega labor camps as slave races?

The Khaoran (Klingons) would never stand for either way. They want a fair fight with invasion troops but the slaughter is almost as bad.

The Catare, the Rotharians, and the Omega would justify it.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Bribery

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So outright bribes rarely work. See.
viewtopic.php?p=42040#p42040

So I experimented with gifts with no expectation, which worked far better than I expected. That brought 75% of them around to then link friendship treaties or trade with a deal sweetener of credits (this works better than ore/crystals as this would have been less expensive).

Eventually many became diplomatically pliant.

However, with patience robust systems owned outright with better infrastructure, is 33% as effective. And that facilitates booming economies. So it probably is smarter to do that, then have huge sums you might use to then persuade them.

As long as you have a trade deal, you can enter systems. One tactic I'm considering is establishing outposts in such trade networks in unaffiliated minor race homesystems. Then hope that is more effective than terraforming minor race planets.

Basically it's a protection racket ie standard mafia extortion by using outposts and starbases.
"My troops will protect your system to maintain trade."
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Bribery

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If you give gifts, then no change may occur and the minor race just smiles and takes your money.

If you give bribes, there is an expectation of purchasing good will.

Big difference.

An outright gift will often remove a diplomatic impasse. That may eventually result in trade and then friendship.

War is horribly expensive as many minor races have defensive technology or vessels and troops. Consider how valuable you believe your vessels and troops are, and weight your veterans' lives against such an invasion. And consider you have to occupy such subjugated people too so you can't just invade and yank out troops and redeploy them.

Plus aerial.bombing from orbit kills the subjugated minor race that is your future workforce. And damages infrastructure you then have to rebuild.

It's not as fun as kicking alien's butts though. It's safer and cost effective.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Bribery

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Having done this over many tens of turns, a combination of bribery, one sided sweetheart deals, and gifts, then does work to fundamentally improve a formerly irascible AI minor race.

Sometimes even bitter minor races' attitudes where they have declared war, then rises to hostile, furious, angry, non-cooperative, etc. It can be somewhat random.

When the Terrans appeared, several minor race's attitude improved as it seemed like they wanted to get along and have a "patron".
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Bribery

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So the test proved it was possible for about 50,000 credits judiciously invested to help diplomacy.

BUT that was 50,000 credits not put to use.(infrastructure and vessels at a critical stage)which subsequently caused issues as the Terrans were friendly but then suddenly without any reason got upset. Then twice wanted 1,000 credits. Which was weird because they gave me a major deposit of duranium. So I figured all was well, then they backstabbed me.

So they sent raids on two systems that were difficult to defend by turn 180+. So if I had maybe ten turns prior foreknowledge, I would have had outposts at least (level 2) almost everywhere else. But not there.

It became a moot point as the Terrans sent waves of destroyers and cruisers. Game essentially over.

So bribe but on your terms. Usually the map I play on is on the largest setting and so no real conflict begins until turn #300. Not this game which is a shame because the bribery and gifting was working.

See by the time you can make lots of money by monopolies, it won't work on Terran empire members as at least the other Terrans get the highest bribery resistance. But it might work on their members ie the minor races who join them.

I really don't like the smug Terrans. They end up very overpowered. It's so bad it's like this scene from Aliens where Ripley and Corporal Hicks jointly feel they should nuke the planet from orbit.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nnHmUk_J6xQ
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Bribery

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I personally don't use bribery. In Civ2 and Civ 3, I believe you can bribe cities to join you and it largely unbalances the game. And in that instance you can effectively turn it off due to high unit costs as whatever high valued units occupy the city, then raises the bribery required. See how that makes sense? You have to bribe all of the occupiers.

In BotE at advanced levels, bribery is turned off. I think I noticed that about turn 600+, but it might have happened far earlier as I don't use it as it is highly unrealistic and it would cost a monsterous amount in reality as you are bribing an entire sector of space time.

Bribery backfires as it offends many minor alien species.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Bribery

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The best way to effectively use bribery.
1. The minor race has a known special ability through buildings which if in the hands of your opponent, becomes a secret weapon. I could make a list, but this spoils the surprise, however wise players would look through at all minor races' special buildings. Like for sabotage. You want that building meaning you are going to be very diplomatic, and if that fails, to bribe them.
2. This works if the minor alien race has a normal or high corruptibility. Otherwise, you just waste your money.
3. This means you have money in the treasury to support these endeavors. You really ought to read my posts on the subject.
4. What happens if the bribe works, is you have a shot at ending their membership with your opponent. If you are wise, you keep giving gifts to get them to the devoted level, then bribe.
5. In some cases, they end up as your members.
6. Some aliens hate you and there is no way to establish a dialogue but they might take a bribe and things improve.
7. Some gifts to minor races in a membership relationship have no effect even after 50,000 has been spent. I have extensively tested this. Certainly the Terran have an extremely powerful diplomatic ability on loyalty. So in such cases, where gifts fail to alter diplomatic status, the only other options are bribes and invasions, with the latter causing galactic war.

I don't like bribes and seldom use them. It is unrealistic as that is an entire sector of 20 light years so would take millions of credits to realistically accomplish.

But I am beta testing and modding and have to thoroughly understand it.

I don't like sabotage as I think across the galaxy it would be highly dependent on your sphere of influence, range, speed, number of starships, advanced tech level, many special buildings, enormous energy, spy networks to do logistical support, and very brave agents who had a decade of training in multiple disciplines.

The most effective intelligence agents in history as arguably the Soviet sleeper agents who illegally entered the USA and patiently waited and acted. This is somewhat depicted in the tv series The Americans. To do that over just 20 light years (so a sector) would be HUGELY expensive.

That said, I do like that certain minor races are deadly saboteurs or assassin's. The problem is they look so differently that it's often implausible. They might tower over everyone and in some cases would be too different for plastic surgery. It still is fascinating though and while you might lower the increase in ability to be more realistic, it obviously is why they are important to game dynamics.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Bribery

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The Terrans and Heyoun like to send in a transport ship and establish first contact and get them as members, then build an outpost or starbase there.

This means you will have several minor alien members belonging to a competitor within your sphere of influence. That is an intolerable situation as it can be a staging area to attack within your empire. They can send ships across the border and sit there. That is like the Russians and Cuba. You then have lethal weapons aimed at your empire from a short distance away.

So bribery might be the only way to end that troubling relationship, and then if they resist, then invade them.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Bribery

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During the Soviet era, they had placed sleeper agents in their KGB illegals program and in some case were planted 20 years prior with the expectation that they or their offspring would be required to carry out a asymmetric warfare against targets like utility companies like city water distribution. There are several articles about it now.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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Re: Bribery

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During current testing I have spent a LOT on targeted bribery to flip memberships, and had it work, but mostly to no lasting avail as even when devoted to the Omega, straight away get reasked to rejoin as members.

Only twice in many attempts did it work...and stole two memberships.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
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